Domestic vs. Import callout

[Shocker187]

I raced a whipple & got beat up on.

[W3rd]

Originally Posted by Shocker187

heads really don't matter when it comes down to forced induction. Flow benchs that test heads are based off vacuum, that goes out the window when you force feed it. Notice that the cams in all boosted engines aren't as radical & are often smaller then the N/A versions of the same engine.

WHoever told you this is dumb. The flow rate of a cylinder head on a forced induction motor is probably more important than on a naturally aspirated car.

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by Shocker187

heads really don't matter when it comes down to forced induction. Flow benchs that test heads are based off vacuum, that goes out the window when you force feed it. Notice that the cams in all boosted engines aren't as radical & are often smaller then the N/A versions of the same engine.

I have a neon, so really can't argue over who has a bigger piece of shit.

How many big power turbo motors have you built or been around? Why do you think people spend the money they do on cylinder heads? Do you think that a built turbo 347 with stock 302 cast iron heads will make the same power as that same 347 with a Yates-aluminum-headed top-end?

You think that cams "aren't as radical" just because they're forced induction vs. N/A? Do you know *why* they're smaller/less "radical"?

[W3rd]

Originally Posted by DSMraver

How many big power turbo motors have you built or been around? Why do you think people spend the money they do on cylinder heads? Do you think that a built turbo 347 with stock 302 cast iron heads will make the same power as that same 347 with a Yates-aluminum-headed top-end?

You think that cams "aren't as radical" just because they're forced induction vs. N/A? Do you know *why* they're smaller/less "radical"?

IIRC a turbo motor has less duration and overlap.

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by W3rd

IIRC a turbo motor has less duration and overlap.

Yes, but the question was *why*...

Don't answer, I want to know if the original target of the questions knows.

Making claims like "heads don't matter" is big talk for someone who hasn't built anything "fast".

I've seen head porting work in an A-B test on 2.0l turbo motors, let alone something with more than 121 cubes!!!

[LTLHOMER]

Originally Posted by DSMraver

How many big power turbo motors have you built or been around? Why do you think people spend the money they do on cylinder heads? Do you think that a built turbo 347 with stock 302 cast iron heads will make the same power as that same 347 with a Yates-aluminum-headed top-end?

You think that cams "aren't as radical" just because they're forced induction vs. N/A? Do you know *why* they're smaller/less "radical"?

Of course heads matter but you can make a lot up with a turbo. I have out of the box AFRs which flow less than ported ls1 heads yet my car makes the same power as my ls1 did on half the boost with similar cubes. I'd go for a beefy set of heads that can take a lot of boost but flow less before I'd worry about having a really killer set of heads. Heads are great but given a set amount of money I'd probably spending it on okay heads and worrying more about the rest of the combo.

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by LTLHOMER

Of course heads matter but you can make a lot up with a turbo. I have out of the box AFRs which flow less than ported ls1 heads yet my car makes the same power as my ls1 did on half the boost with similar cubes. I'd go for a beefy set of heads that can take a lot of boost but flow less before I'd worry about having a really killer set of heads. Heads are great but given a set amount of money I'd probably spending it on okay heads and worrying more about the rest of the combo.

Exactly, it's all about the "combo" and how everything works together. You still can't run junk and expect to make power...

[Shocker187]

I don't give a funk, give me a ported stock head and I'll turn the boost up a few psi and make more power. Which is going to make more power a 3k turbo or 3k heads? tell me why?

Here's my head I did myself & I know nothing about heads.........
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/P...ead_167943.htm

I spent probably 20hours just porting & polishing the cast marks out, didn't try to go crazy with it, just clean it up and smooth her out.

[hooray for farva]

those are cute lil ports arent they ......

[webleedorange61]

Originally Posted by jtcstrat

ive raced bolt on/pullied cobras, no idea on the port.

ic, I wanted to run your car for fun but I saw you had problems almost all summer. Good luck with the new build should be sweet.

[Shocker187]

Originally Posted by hooray for farva

those are cute lil ports arent they ......

it is what it is, does the job. if I had 4 more to do, I might be doing something right.

[hooray for farva]

i think the same thing when i see 5liter ford ports .... im like damn how they get any gasses through those lil things

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by Shocker187

I don't give a funk, give me a ported stock head and I'll turn the boost up a few psi and make more power. Which is going to make more power a 3k turbo or 3k heads? tell me why?

Here's my head I did myself & I know nothing about heads.........
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/P...ead_167943.htm

I spent probably 20hours just porting & polishing the cast marks out, didn't try to go crazy with it, just clean it up and smooth her out.

You're making it about budget now.

Of course you'll make more power with a turbo kit vs. a set of heads, don't be a smart-ass.

You can't argue that the motor with the 3k turbo kit and the 3k heads wouldn't be faster than the same car with just the 3k turbo kit on it.

[hooray for farva]

Originally Posted by DSMraver

Yes, but the question was *why*...

Don't answer, I want to know if the original target of the questions knows.

Making claims like "heads don't matter" is big talk for someone who hasn't built anything "fast".

I've seen head porting work in an A-B test on 2.0l turbo motors, let alone something with more than 121 cubes!!!

heads matter as much as the turbo or pistons you use ....... and lots of duration and short overlap to pack the cyl with charge and keep it ther . hi overlapped n/a cams will let all the precious boost slip past

[Shocker187]

Originally Posted by DSMraver

You're making it about budget now.

Of course you'll make more power with a turbo kit vs. a set of heads, don't be a smart-ass.

You can't argue that the motor with the 3k turbo kit and the 3k heads wouldn't be faster than the same car with just the 3k turbo kit on it.

I simply stated the truth & you threw out the insults. How many bad ass cars I've I built or been around. I personally built a few, but helped on several big horsepower builds in my day.

You think I know nothing about cars, then this weekend maybe we should have a showdown? My car vs yours?

[jtcstrat]

Originally Posted by webleedorange61

ic, I wanted to run your car for fun but I saw you had problems almost all summer. Good luck with the new build should be sweet.

wh, i was just making more power, then ran outta fuel, then ran outta maf, then broke the tensioner, its how the game goes tho.

Car was 10x stronger once i got it all tuned and squared away. then i blew the oil pump to pieces and toasted the motor. lol

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by Shocker187

I simply stated the truth & you threw out the insults. How many bad ass cars I've I built or been around. I personally built a few, but helped on several big horsepower builds in my day.

You think I know nothing about cars, then this weekend maybe we should have a showdown? My car vs yours?

I love how it comes down to "I'll race you to prove I'm right!!!11" How quick/fast is your car? My times are in my project log, nothing to prove, I'm just a full weight street car on pump gas.

I just re-read my post, and I'm pretty sure there's no insults, short of telling you not to be a smart-ass by making a completely unrelated comparison for what we were talking about.

You didn't state any "truth", just your opinion, which is wrong. Head choice/porting *does* matter on a boosted motor. Physics doesn't care what you think you know, the laws of fluid dynamics apply to everyone.

If you've built/helped build several "bad ass" cars, then you know that cylinder head choice matters. Also, stop putting words in my mouth, I never said you don't know anything about cars, just that you were wrong in this case.

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by DSMraver

I love how it comes down to "I'll race you to prove I'm right!!!11" How quick/fast is your car? My times are in my project log, nothing to prove, I'm just a full weight street car on pump gas.

I just re-read my post, and I'm pretty sure there's no insults, short of telling you not to be a smart-ass by making a completely unrelated comparison for what we were talking about.

You didn't state any "truth", just your opinion, which is wrong. Head choice/porting *does* matter on a boosted motor. Physics doesn't care what you think you know, the laws of fluid dynamics apply to everyone.

If you've built/helped build several "bad ass" cars, then you know that cylinder head choice matters. Also, stop putting words in my mouth, I never said you don't know anything about cars, just that you were wrong in this case.

We can add another car to the list if you'd like. I've been meaning to take a crack at this skittle, but he's too much of a pussy to meet halfway so arguing with him about a location would not be worth it... Just my .02 cents.

[DSMraver]

Originally Posted by Maximus

We can add another car to the list if you'd like. I've been meaning to take a crack at this skittle, but he's too much of a pussy to meet halfway so arguing with him about a location would not be worth it... Just my .02 cents.

Not sure what the issue would be, Lapeer is open this Saturday. Or is this going to turn into some "I need to race from 60" or "I only race on the street" bs?

For the record, I'm not going to get dragged into this whole street-racing drama BS. I have too much going on, and my car is what it is.

Does his Skittle go quicker than 11.8's@124?

[Shocker187]

Originally Posted by Maximus

We can add another car to the list if you'd like. I've been meaning to take a crack at this skittle, but he's too much of a pussy to meet halfway so arguing with him about a location would not be worth it... Just my .02 cents.

The day we cross paths & you feel the need to call me a bitch, pussy or anything else, your asking for a punch to the mouth. Ask any person on this board who knows me, because I'm not the one to piss off or throw insults at. My car vs you mini?


yeah bring the holeshot turbo godly DSM out this weekend. We'll run them dig, roll or can setup some cones and autocross it. Either way I'm down to shut some of you up.